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Post by Hexspa on Aug 1, 2017 21:30:23 GMT
Indeed. More and more as I go I'm learning that, like they asked Mr. Burns on the Simpsons, hard work and sticktoitiveness are paramount in anything to which you might intend to put your hand.
Thanks.
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Post by Ethan Winer on Aug 4, 2017 14:33:58 GMT
I'll add that I never (not once ever) calibrated REW for SPL. Yes, it complains every time I run it. I don't care. All that matters for me is relative levels versus frequency.
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Post by Hexspa on Aug 5, 2017 2:03:21 GMT
I'll add that I never (not once ever) calibrated REW for SPL. Yes, it complains every time I run it. I don't care. All that matters for me is relative levels versus frequency. Stick it to the man, Ethan. That'll show em
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Post by arnyk on Aug 5, 2017 15:51:08 GMT
I'll add that I never (not once ever) calibrated REW for SPL. Yes, it complains every time I run it. I don't care. All that matters for me is relative levels versus frequency.Ditto, Ditto, and I even have a mic calibrator on hand.
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Post by Hexspa on Aug 6, 2017 2:23:00 GMT
For some reason, the direct results I've gotten have never been that useful for the reason Ethan mentioned: it's all about relative SPL. Telling the software that the pink noise is at x SPL is virtually useless. It is useful for getting your measurement within a reasonable range on the graph, though. It also ensures you won't be clipping or have forgotten to enable phantom power.
In any case, that's why I've used the "offset" feature under the cog wheel menu to adjust the absolute points to center on 70dB in the charts.
Thanks.
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Post by uchihaitachi on Aug 6, 2017 23:11:32 GMT
Thank you all for the invaluable advice. It's great not having to wade through and waste money on pages of marketing BS to get to quality recommendations.
Having just moved into the new home, I've been stuck in a conundrum as to which JBL lineup I should purchase.
The room itself is rather large, but asymmetrical. The LHS is a large square shaped area, and the right hand side is narrower and longer (sort of an out of proportion L shape) - it is here (the narrower and longer part that my computer etc. are set up against the wall.
I was considering the LSR308 upon arnyk's recommendation, but realised that I might not be able to give it enough clearance between the wall (not totally sure how much it needs) for it to perform to its full capabilities. I've also looked at the LSR305, but am slightly concerned if I might be bothered by its lack of bass extension.
I listen to about 50% Classical (with a focus on solo piano music) and 50% Jazz.
This led me to consider getting the pair of LSR305 and a LSR310S (the sub-woofer bundle) which is priced at 565GBP. Yet, I am not sure if I should get this, or if I should just purchase a pair of LSR305 only stands which is 298GBP. The LSR308 pair with stands is 418GBP. LSR308 pair with the sub-woofer bundle is 723GBP.
What would be the most rational way of going about this? The particulars of this conundrum is that I am not at all familiar with how room specifications affect sub-woofers. For example, if the 308 starts becoming very muddy due to the room specifications, would it be better to use a sub-woofer to deal with the low end. If so, would this sub-woofer plus setup need the 308? Wouldn't the 305 fulfil the mid/upper frequency roles more than sufficiently? I have also seen sub-woofers placed to one side rather than being in the centre symmetrically, which would allow me to make most of the space that I do have available.
Than does this essentially boil down into a LSR305 + subwoofer vs LSR308 standalone?
I am quite confused with the addition of a new variable, I would be most grateful for any input.
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Post by arnyk on Aug 7, 2017 10:20:42 GMT
Thank you all for the invaluable advice. It's great not having to wade through and waste money on pages of marketing BS to get to quality recommendations. Having just moved into the new home, I've been stuck in a conundrum as to which JBL lineup I should purchase. The room itself is rather large, but asymmetrical. The LHS is a large square shaped area, and the right hand side is narrower and longer (sort of an out of proportion L shape) - it is here (the narrower and longer part that my computer etc. are set up against the wall. I was considering the LSR308 upon arnyk's recommendation, but realised that I might not be able to give it enough clearance between the wall (not totally sure how much it needs) for it to perform to its full capabilities. I've also looked at the LSR305, but am slightly concerned if I might be bothered by its lack of bass extension. I listen to about 50% Classical (with a focus on solo piano music) and 50% Jazz. This led me to consider getting the pair of LSR305 and a LSR310S (the sub-woofer bundle) which is priced at 565GBP. Yet, I am not sure if I should get this, or if I should just purchase a pair of LSR305 only stands which is 298GBP. The LSR308 pair with stands is 418GBP. LSR308 pair with the sub-woofer bundle is 723GBP. The hidden agenda is what are your tastes in bass? Sticking to the facts, the LSR30x speakers have rear ports, so you have to give them some clearance. If the area behind the speaker has free space 10x the cross section of the port, then it is more than large enough. For example, spacing them a few inches from a wall suffices. If want really good clean bass that is matched to the room, IME you will frustrate yourself forever if you try to match your speakers to how bass shapes up in your room. Instead, get a parametric equalizer such as those offered by MiniDSP and adjust the speaker response to the specific needs of the room. OK, that means you also have buy one of their measurement-type mics, but be advised that thousands of audiophiles and recordists have already done this without being permanently harmed by the experience. Of course if you want REALLY good bass, that takes at least two subwoofers, well-separated like in opposite corners.
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Post by Hexspa on Aug 7, 2017 11:19:36 GMT
...and Ethan recommends only EQing in cuts below 150Hz.
He's further suggested only subtracting half the dB level you want but I'll argue that if you've verified that points within a reasonable radius around your listening position meet your targets then you can be as precise as you'd like.
In other words, if you're alone at a mixing position then you can be more focused with EQ. If you're EQing for multiple seats then that's where compensated EQ and, perhaps, multiple subs really start to shine.
Thanks.
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Post by balduin on Aug 27, 2017 2:16:05 GMT
Oh also another quick question, are any of you familiar with the xr824 vs hr824? Hi, I found measurements of both the models. The text is in German, though. XR824There's a -20 dB drop at around 15 kHz [measurement on axis, distance = 2m]. For the HR824 MK2, you can request a free copy of the 2008 review via: www.soundandrecording.de/request-article/_SR_2008_07_074_39587/The measurements show around -12 dB at 15 kHz. According to the reviewers, the small diffuser in front of the membranes might cause these drops. [How] Would this affect work?
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Post by Ethan Winer on Aug 30, 2017 14:08:26 GMT
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Post by balduin on Nov 10, 2017 14:47:59 GMT
Hi Ethan, I asked Mackie about the specific finding a while ago but still received no reply. No idea if that is due to a "screwed up" measurement by the reviewers or really an anomaly with this, and the preceding, series. The reviewers use a semi-anechoic chamber which is considered to be anechoic from 100 Hz and above [ www.soundandrecording.de/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Wir-testen-01.jpg ]; below 100 Hz they do a combined near-field measurement. Maybe it would be helpful if somebody who owns the speakers could do a free-field measurement.
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Post by Ethan Winer on Nov 15, 2017 18:38:17 GMT
I just happen to have a measurement someone else did of a Mackie HR824. I don't have permission to publish this, but it's from several years ago and I can't imagine why the guy would mind. From the description of how he placed a microphone on a huge stand 20 get up in the air inside a large auditorium: "Presented here is quasi-anechoic frequency response data ... I performed the tests with Acoustisoft's ETF measurement program and with a B&K 4007 microphone placed six feet from the test subject. The speakers were 20 feet from any boundary yielding an anechoic time interval of about 35 milliseconds and an approximate lower frequency limit of 30 Hertz."
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Post by balduin on Dec 8, 2017 10:38:18 GMT
Thank you Ethan! That's much appreciated.
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