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Post by rock on Nov 3, 2018 20:07:18 GMT
Answer to Rock: Typar is a woven weave housewrap. I understand and I am OK with, Typar reflecting higher frequencies as long as it passes the lower frequencies. So then you choose to have little or no absorption at mid/hi frequencies, not even for early reflections from your monitors. |
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Post by grega60438 on Nov 3, 2018 20:10:24 GMT
Equipment Room-No absorption treatment picture. (two links to same picture) www.dropbox.com/s/nisuianw2hd3ntk/Control%20Room-No%20absorption%20treatment.jpg?dl=0 i.imgur.com/GLYriOn.jpg
The picture shows the studs installed on the ceiling, to support the Typar (house wrap) part of the sound absorption.
Task plan: 1. Paint 2. Finish electrical outlets 3. Attach Typar (House wrap) to ceiling studs, leaving minimum opening to insert cellulose 4. Insert loose cellulose and close opening 5. REW Measurement 6. Build super-chunks 7. REW Measurement 8. Tile concrete floor
This is only the Equipment Room treatment tasks, and does not include the Studio Recording Area coming later at stage 2.
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Post by grega60438 on Nov 3, 2018 20:14:52 GMT
Does the Equipment Room absorption affect the adjacent larger Studio Recording Area (low frequencies)? I suspect it will. I have the before REW measurements for the larger Studio Recording Area, and will have after REW measurement after the Equipment Room absorption is complete. Not sure how loud dB the REW measurement has to be to make a noticeable difference.
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Post by grega60438 on Nov 3, 2018 20:21:49 GMT
Hi Rock,
This is the Equipment Room, so no monitors. I am treating the Equipment Room, assuming Equipment Room absorption will affect the adjacent larger Studio Recording Area, low frequencies.
The Studio Recording Area, also doubles as the mixing area and is where the speakers are.
You bring up an important good point, there will be other materials used for mid/high frequency absorption where the speakers are.
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Post by rock on Nov 4, 2018 16:06:02 GMT
Does the Control Room absorption affect the adjacent larger Studio Recording Area (low frequencies)? I suspect it will. I have the before REW measurements for the larger Studio Recording Area, and will have after REW measurement after the Control Room absorption is complete. Not sure how loud dB the REW measurement has to be to make a noticeable difference. It really will have very little to no effect, especially if you have good isolation between the rooms. BTW I'm not building any studios in the foreseeable future and when I did in the past I did not have this book but I checked out a copy of Rod Gervais' book from my local library system anyway to brush up some details: www.amazon.com/Home-Recording-Studio-Build-Like/dp/143545717X I know I mentioned this book before but I really hope you have a copy. It's not cheap but I think it will save you tons of money and prevent you from doing things that won't help and possibly even detrimental.
I think any construction involving isolation should be completed before any acoustic treatment is applied. You can go back and re-do it later but it'll involve extra work, time and money. Also, I don't see any provision for HVAC, Rod's book has some great ideas but you really need to do all that first.
On this forum, we really don't talk much at all about a complete studio build and focus on treatment so this is not the place to get the best, complete and comprehensive info for building a studio.
But, if you want to test your isolation, one very simple thing you can do with REW is to make a sweep with the speaker at one end and mic in other end of the studio and note the level, that will be your baseline of the average SPL level in the studio. Then, move only the mic into the middle of the control room, leaving the speaker in the studio, (make sure you run the wire in a way that won't create a sound leak! Hopefully you already have a cable system installed between the studio and CR) and run the sweep again with exactly the same settings. The difference will reveal your isolation at all frequencies.
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Post by rock on Nov 4, 2018 16:37:09 GMT
This is the Control Room, so no monitors... The Studio Recording Area, also doubles as the mixing area and is where the speakers are. In my world, the Control Room is the room where the mixing is done and the Studio is the room where the talent creates the music that is recorded. Now I understand that a singe room can function as both and I see your Studio Room is that room. So what are you doing in what you call the Control Room? |
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Post by grega60438 on Nov 4, 2018 23:09:57 GMT
The Control Room has all the equipment, and is also used to record the scratch vocal. So basically the Control Room is an isolation booth.
The drums are recorded in the Studio, with everyone else recorded direct wired, so no noticeable noise producing instruments in the Studio during the drum recording. Any noise must be kept to the Control Room. I assume the Control Room to Studio isolation must be sufficient, as I have recorded this way multiple times and scratch vocal is not heard in the drum recording.
After the bass and drum recording are acceptable, record noise producing instruments. Example electric guitars using real amps and cabs. I also record acoustic guitar recorded in the studio by itself. When there is a decent final mix, the scratch vocal is replaced by a new recording completed in the Studio by itself.
I have recorded everyone in the studio at the same time, separated by temporary walls, but prefer the above method for a higher quality.
Monti’s Czardasz is an example of recording of everyone in the studio at the same time. IMO turned out well. You can review at: alcornstudios.com/music/
Monti’s Czardasz is towards the top of the page.
A heavy metal High School band is at the bottom of the webpage. Jonathon Mantel: Suburbio below the Monti’s Czardasz is recorded separately as I prefer.
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Post by grega60438 on Nov 5, 2018 0:18:09 GMT
This caused me to listen critically to my recordings at my website, IMO there is good lows and mid range. If you listen to the recordings, do you think I need better high frequencies? If yes, perhaps I need better treatment for the highs and need to do a better mixing job on the high frequencies? It could use a tweak? Hmm...
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Post by Hexspa on Nov 5, 2018 3:39:35 GMT
Suburbio initially sounded like it was bulging around 600Hz. In any case, you can improve your highs by adding in some parallel distortion. I use a free VST by Fine Cut Bodies as well as Saturn by Fabfilter and Andrew Scheps uses an Aphex Aural Exciter by Waves. It's kind of nice since you're adding in frequencies rather than just boosting something that might be dark.
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Post by grega60438 on Nov 5, 2018 3:55:06 GMT
Thank you Hexspa, I will check those out. I really think I these recordings have room for improvement. I think on these tracks I focused so much on the lows and mids, I lost a little perspective. It's not bad IMO, but for sure has room for improvement. I have Waves and others. Just need to make the effort to improve, and I am trying always to improve.
BTW some of these Jonathon Mantel tracks actually made it on the radio in the USA. :-) Personally I love the Next Idol American by Jonathon Mantel. Please listen to that one and tell me what you think. |
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Post by grega60438 on Nov 5, 2018 5:13:16 GMT
On the "Next Idol American" by Jonathon Mantel: The acoustic is my Taylor Dreadnaught Acoustic Guitar, which made my mouth water when I heard it. For electric guitar, Jon is playing my custom modified Lone Star Strat, going through the Mesa Boogie Triaxis and the TC Electronic G-force for the effect. The electric guitar cabinets are a mix of two custom speaker cabinets I built using a Celestion V30 and Weber Bluedog speakers. I really liked how the drums pop through occasionally. Notice how the snare changes side to side. I really like this song.
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Post by Hexspa on Nov 7, 2018 4:11:53 GMT
I think all the sounds are good and the production has the perfect vibe. For the mix, I feel like the levels are too all over the place. The bendy lead makes me turn down the track which makes the rhythm section disappear. The vocal feels mixed to the rhythm section, forward which isn't unusual, but then the lead instruments come in and blast me in the face again. Are you keeping a consistent volume when setting levels or do you bounce around a lot? This isn't really my preferred style of music but listen to "Crimson and Clover" and you'll hear a mix with similar sounds all sitting together in the right spot. That brings me to referencing which I hope you're doing as well. I don't mean to come off as an insufferable dick, it's just my personality  |
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Post by grega60438 on Nov 8, 2018 2:27:59 GMT
It's cool, we all have our opinions, like the artist opinion when he wanted the lead guitar in your face. Artist liked that delay on just one spot on the voice, which I tried to talk him out of, but the customer is always right.  I had two voice over jobs over the last two nights, and tonight I can get back to work on the studio. Scrubbing walls, floors and taping off for the paint.
I did run some more REW measurements at multiple louder levels to see if the Control Room absorption would have any affect on the Recording Studio area. I will post treatment comparisons later. It may not have an significant effect. It is really just curiosity. In any case, treatment of the Control Room (isolation room) will occur anyway which should improve the recorded scratch tracks that occur in the Control Room (isolation room).
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Post by grega60438 on Nov 8, 2018 3:25:46 GMT
Hi Hexspa,
I don't mean to come off as someone who is not willing to learn. BTW Suburbio was my very first recording in the newly built studio. I listened to the artist #1, could of done a better job. I am striving to improve and heard AND VALUE your recommendations which are greatly appreciated.
Peace out! :-)
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Post by Hexspa on Nov 8, 2018 7:20:11 GMT
Ya, I just have a thing against overly dynamic music. I hate turning my volume up and down all the time. There is a line between taste and technique but it varies a lot from person-to-person.
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