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Post by mrfye17 on Feb 17, 2023 1:06:29 GMT
Hi Great People of the world.
I am trying to find the optimal positioning for my monitors in my home studio (primarily for Mixing).
There are 2 different positions, both with a good 'Phantom Centre, Depth and Imaging.
The problem that I have is that at Position 1, the Soundstage is even and balanced but the sound from the L/R Speakers blend within the Soundstage, while in Position 2, even though the Soundstage is even and balanced as well, the sound from the L/R Speakers is distinctive - meaning that I can hear Left Spkr distinctively from the Right Spkr and vice versa.
My question is:
Should the sound blend more like Position 1 or is it better to have the separation that Position 2 offers?
Which would be a more real and accurate representation of a Mix, while Mixing for the real world?
Thanking you all in advance,
Chris
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Post by Hexspa on Feb 18, 2023 16:26:55 GMT
You should have a solid, centered phantom image and ideally the speakers 'disappear'. You want to know that left is left and right is right but not have your ear drawn to the speaker or subwoofer. All you want to hear is music. Make sure your speakers are both the same volume, you can test with filtered pink noise and have spectrally balanced reflections. You can read more about that here: www.hifizine.com/2011/12/listening-room-reflections-and-the-energy-time-curve/ |
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Post by shuggy22 on Jun 24, 2023 23:04:02 GMT
Hi, 1st of all if your room is a adequate dimension width and length ideally a rectangle, you'll be pointing your speaker down the length of the room yea...you first null occurs at 38% out from the end of the room that's listening position (where you rest your seat). Now say your console is 3 feet in depth and 5.5 feet in width...you most like be sitting about 4 feet out from the BACK of you console or where the shelf you place you speakers on. So say you put your speakers (woofers) about that 3 to 4 feet apart, that is the distance you should be sitting away from them...in the SWEET SPOT....basically you triangulate...you sit the same distance from them as the are apart from each other. If your room has been brought into balance with proper treatments, Bass traps corners (or so), low mids front and center of your desk (behind your listen position, speaker array) moving out from the corners more low mid traps till you on bot sides of your listening position should be treated so you are able to hear your mid range. Okay...so and so around you room with treatments the back wall could be pretty much what your front wall is...(bass traps corners and some low mid to deal with peaks that build up there) or may want to install QRD diffusion make room sound bigger and bring in the reflections you WANT so your rooms not to dead...clouds over your mixing position etc etc. Okay that's a rough outline for treatment...point being, you can get some pretty strange anomalies going setting up speakers if your room is not treated in reference to it's dimensions and the treatments you choose/apply. Every read Ethan's FAQ'S page....vital...here is the link to it below. You mention "sound-stage" I get it but I think the real terminology is the "free field". In the case of your project studio the free field is the room it's self. A free field is a region where the acoustic waves can propagate free from obstructions that would otherwise interfere with the sound path. How you go about apply treatments in your room will be everything to how you hear or achieve what you mentioned "Depth and Imaging". I have trained myself to listen to reflections in rooms, I have heard some of the weirdest anomalies that some people just don't notice, but the are apparent when listen back to your mixes, and how your mixes will translate outside of your mixing environment. Everything you want from your project studio you can achieve if you have a half decent room and have treated it properly...Sorry but in the end, we can run,but we can't hide on this LAW. Here is Ethan's FAQ'S page. You'll find his diagrams on best listening position here. ethanwiner.com/acoustics.html |
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Post by Hexspa on Jun 27, 2023 4:15:25 GMT
Hi, 1st of all if your room is a adequate dimension width and length ideally a rectangle, you'll be pointing your speaker down the length of the room yea...you first null occurs at 38% out from the end of the room that's listening position (where you rest your seat). Now say your console is 3 feet in depth and 5.5 feet in width...you most like be sitting about 4 feet out from the BACK of you console or where the shelf you place you speakers on. So say you put your speakers (woofers) about that 3 to 4 feet apart, that is the distance you should be sitting away from them...in the SWEET SPOT....basically you triangulate...you sit the same distance from them as the are apart from each other. If your room has been brought into balance with proper treatments, Bass traps corners (or so), low mids front and center of your desk (behind your listen position, speaker array) moving out from the corners more low mid traps till you on bot sides of your listening position should be treated so you are able to hear your mid range. Okay...so and so around you room with treatments the back wall could be pretty much what your front wall is...(bass traps corners and some low mid to deal with peaks that build up there) or may want to install QRD diffusion make room sound bigger and bring in the reflections you WANT so your rooms not to dead...clouds over your mixing position etc etc. Okay that's a rough outline for treatment...point being, you can get some pretty strange anomalies going setting up speakers if your room is not treated in reference to it's dimensions and the treatments you choose/apply. Every read Ethan's FAQ'S page....vital...here is the link to it below. You mention "sound-stage" I get it but I think the real terminology is the "free field". In the case of your project studio the free field is the room it's self. A free field is a region where the acoustic waves can propagate free from obstructions that would otherwise interfere with the sound path. How you go about apply treatments in your room will be everything to how you hear or achieve what you mentioned "Depth and Imaging". I have trained myself to listen to reflections in rooms, I have heard some of the weirdest anomalies that some people just don't notice, but the are apparent when listen back to your mixes, and how your mixes will translate outside of your mixing environment. Everything you want from your project studio you can achieve if you have a half decent room and have treated it properly...Sorry but in the end, we can run,but we can't hide on this LAW. Here is Ethan's FAQ'S page. You'll find his diagrams on best listening position here. ethanwiner.com/acoustics.htmlHi, shuggy22, welcome and thanks for helping out. I just want to clarify what you mean about "first null occurs at 38% out from the end of the room". While this axial length point has been suggested by noted Acoustics authority Wes Lachot, it's not because there's a null there. Indeed, he suggests it because he's reasoned it to be a point with balanced modal performance i.e. no severe nulls. To this end, let's clarify what we mean about "first null". In terms of time, and we're talking sub-63 milliseconds (1000ms/16Hz), It stands to reason that the "first null" will be the speaker-boundary interference response (SBIR) of any boundaries nearest the speaker followed by any half-way reflection between the speaker and the receiver (mic or listener) and then the periodic amplitude response pattern governed by the room's boundaries (primarily axial mode resonances) in the lowest frequencies below the Transition Frequency will produce nulls. It takes longer for the modal response to build because the wave cycles are slow i.e. you can't have a 20Hz resonance until there's 20Hz which takes 50ms to come into existence. In terms of frequency, the "first null" would occur at the center of the room, 50% the length, width and/or height. This is because the fundamental mode's wavelength is 2x each axial dimension. For example, a 16' length will produce a fundamental resonance with a wavelength of 32' and an SPL null at that frequency in the center of the room (but a velocity maxima which is inaudible). The same thing happens with each modal dimension then proceeds further up the frequency spectrum harmonically producing nulls at 1/4 and 3/4 dimensions (2nd harmonic), 1/6, 1/2, 5/6 (3rd harmonic), and 1/8,3/8,5/8,and 7/8 (4th harmonic). Like typical harmonic distortion, consideration of further harmonics is not a primary concern due to change in behavior of acoustic energy past the Transition Frequency. If we divide 3 by 8, we get 37.5% which is pretty close to Mr. Lachot's 38% recommendation. For this reason, I have been convinced by another acoustics professional, Mr. Grimani, that the better initial locations for a listening position are 20, 32 and 45% the LWH of the room. I say "initial" because considerations like surface absorption and hidden gremlins in the wall may influence the exact spot. Always measure to confirm. Hopefully this clarifies things. If I misunderstood you, please let me know. Thanks. |
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Post by mlbchitown on Jul 2, 2023 2:28:10 GMT
Hi Great People of the world. I am trying to find the optimal positioning for my monitors in my home studio (primarily for Mixing). There are 2 different positions, both with a good 'Phantom Centre, Depth and Imaging. The problem that I have is that at Position 1, the Soundstage is even and balanced but the sound from the L/R Speakers blend within the Soundstage, while in Position 2, even though the Soundstage is even and balanced as well, the sound from the L/R Speakers is distinctive - meaning that I can hear Left Spkr distinctively from the Right Spkr and vice versa. My question is: Should the sound blend more like Position 1 or is it better to have the separation that Position 2 offers? Which would be a more real and accurate representation of a Mix, while Mixing for the real world? Thanking you all in advance, Chris |
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Post by mlbchitown on Jul 2, 2023 2:29:14 GMT
See the free resources areas on the following websites.
John Brandt
Carl Tatz
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